With shipping and tax, 1682$ but that is still 1200 more than the hid price, for a sun hood 6", ballast and both HPS MH lights,

I Will be getting a SS800w now though, THANK YOU maybe after i go through an HID run for comparison, maybe not, depends on when i startup

what do you think of my proposal in general & off topic about growing horizontal in veg then vertical in flower instead of scrog? hoping to have someone test this idea

But back to your beauties, can you get that pic of those four internodes? the one with the E, i want to see how fast stretch happens in a scrog, i see youtube journals that i think screw with the dates and have two and a hlaf foot stretch "2weeks" in... is this possible or bull?

painterwand wrote:what do you think of my proposal in general & off topic about growing horizontal in veg then vertical in flower instead of scrog?

Well, I'm a nub, but isn't a scrog grow exactly what you describe? They veg horizontally across the screen and once it's filled you flip to flower and let them grow vertically?

As for the node, I will try to find it, but since I moved the tent this week-end, I had to replace the scrog so that branch might not be where it was when I took the picture. I will try, though.

And yes, as you determined, the SS800W is a lot more expensive than even a 1000W HID with reflector and ballast. Twice as much, in fact. Which is why I will go with HID for the bigger op.

SME: it turns out I am allowed 25 plants, not 15. Which means our original plan of a 4x8+4x4 for a perpetual grow will need to be readjusted to account for those extra 10 plants.

Yeah, sort of, on your plants though, your lolipopping everything under the screen, right? giving more energy to where the light is,


With my way you fan each branch until the plant looks like a peacocks fan in flower and spread the light across the plant, getting equal light spread should mean that the bud sites closer to the soil/hydro could be bigger because they have more nutrients with the larger stalk, plus it could get almost no vertical growth until flower, which would be awesome

FCGFrank wrote:Is there a point in bloom when the flowers stop stretching and divert all their energy into growing the buds, or is there a continuous growth of branches?

2-4 weeks after you start 12/12 the biggest part the stretch should be over (depending on strains, light, etc.) but they are alive and they'll get bigger until they start to die...just slower.

FCGFrank wrote:

Psuagro wrote:Looks like we are getting to the fun part/ nice and healthy green too!bravo grower.............What do you think of the light so far Frank????

I honestly don't know and I actually intended to ask this question here, since I have no frame of reference.

My plants look amazingly good to me, but this is my first time grow, so subjectively, I don't feel my input as any credibility.

I will say though, anyone thinking LED don't emit heat are in for a rude awakening. Two SS400W in that tent heats up thing really fast.

My 1/10hp chiller isn't enough to handle the load, but overnight the chiller brings down the loop temp to 57 so that during the day, the temperature will rise slowly but steadily. After about 10 hours I have to shut down a SS400W temporarily for the remaining 12 hours.

Obviously I fucked up when I was planning this grow, lack of experience played a part. For 150$ more I could have had a 1/4 hp, now I need to buy an entirely new chiller. Pisses me off.

He asked how YOU like it.

There's no doubt in my mind that the CLW lights veg well based on results from many journals here. Your plants look healthy.

Yes, a very common myth is that LED lights don't get hot.

Well, for the next one, buy the biggest chiller you can afford (within reason) if you plant to cool many lights, tents and reservoirs. You'll find a use for the little one...

FCGFrank wrote:

painterwand wrote:Hey Frank, been watching your grow with lots of interest in LED with 90F temps, still a noob so what is normal temps? like 70-80?

was wondering if you could take a pic of those same nodes as last time so we could see how much they grew in a week?

Normal temps under HID is usually between 75-80 according to the literature. Other more experienced growers may chip in here, I usually use Ed R's book for such questions. The idea with pushing temps with LED is that they diffuse heat better, which means with LED the ambient temperature will be equal everywhere in the grow area, including above the canopy. HID produces more heat and usually temperature above canopy will be 10F higher than ambient temperature.

So if you use HID lighting, typically, if your grow room reads at 80F, the top of the canopy just under the light will read at 90F.

That's the general idea behind pushing 90F.

However, unless you provide enough umoles of PAR and CO2 to match the increase in temps, photosynthesis will not be sped up.

75-80 with ambient CO2 levels is about right but there are actually several scientific theories that prompted me to suggest those temps in your case. If a grow area has proper air circulation the temps should be pretty even all around (compared to a room with no circulation) but hot air always rises so it's always warmer at the top than the bottom and middle.
1) When supplementing CO2 as much as you are the plants transpire at a different rate allowing you raise the ambient temps above 85f.
2) It's been suggested by some that raising the ambient temps under LED, during flower (maybe even more in the later stage of flowering *IF* the plants can tolerate it), makes up for the loss of some non-visible spectra that HID uses.

If you don't give the plants enough light and food the extra CO2 will help much less and they won't tolerate as much heat. Or, conversely, If you give them more CO2, you can give them more food, light and heat for more growth.

FCGFrank wrote:

painterwand wrote:what do you think of my proposal in general & off topic about growing horizontal in veg then vertical in flower instead of scrog?

Well, I'm a nub, but isn't a scrog grow exactly what you describe? They veg horizontally across the screen and once it's filled you flip to flower and let them grow vertically?

As for the node, I will try to find it, but since I moved the tent this week-end, I had to replace the scrog so that branch might not be where it was when I took the picture. I will try, though.

And yes, as you determined, the SS800W is a lot more expensive than even a 1000W HID with reflector and ballast. Twice as much, in fact. Which is why I will go with HID for the bigger op.

SME: it turns out I am allowed 25 plants, not 15. Which means our original plan of a 4x8+4x4 for a perpetual grow will need to be readjusted to account for those extra 10 plants.

I thought it sounded SCROG-ish too, maybe we need sketches?

You used to post a lot of pictures.

Yes, LED isn't the best option for low budget growers. It's getting better but costs are still high.

That makes it easier, I'd assume. I think I know what you want to do so I''ll think about it a bit. If you have input let me know...

SisterMaryElephant wrote:You used to post a lot of pictures.

I figured you guys would be bored of them by now, there's really nothing interesting happening.

Here

I never get tired of looking at mj plants...

SisterMaryElephant wrote:I never get tired of looking at mj plants...

About the extra plants, I was thinking of keeping this 2x4 and pair it with a 2x2 for vegging (as we discussed previously), 4 plants each instead of 2...

So:
4x8 8 plants (bloom) with HID
4x4 8 plants (veg) with HID
2x4 4 plants (bloom) with LED
2x2 4 plants (veg) with LED

This leaves room for a mother.

I'll keep growing KM in my LED tents if it's as good as people say it is, and grow a faster flowering strain in the HID tents. Just need to find a similar strain to KM but that flowers faster.

thank you Frank, much more realistic than a foot of growth

i have uploaded some sketches, on the other blog, i dont want to hijack your journal

painterwand wrote:thank you Frank, much more realistic than a foot of growth

Everything on Internet needs to be taken with a grain of salt, anything cannabis related even more so in my experience. In the last few months of posting around a couple of forums, I've found a many posters have an ego the size of Jupiter without the brains to back it up. Lying to look like a God Grower is their way of making up for that, and in the end, it just mixes people up even further.

Youtube videos showcasing grows are nothing more than e-peen extenders. They never include academic information susceptible of being helpful to someone wishing to grow.

Here's how I'd do it based on the room size talk we had a few pages back:
8 plants - two 4x4 for flowering
8 plants - one 4x4 for vegging
8 plants - one 2x2 for clones
1 plant - one 2x2 for a mother

one 2x4 for drying/curing depending on how you plan to cure...

This leaves room for more clones and mothers without needing another tent for those and when you expand you can just add more flower/veg tents until you need more clone/mother tents.